TV by the Numbers - Latest Comments in Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Jake — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 10:10:21 -0000

Dexter is #1 on ITunes download. I don't care about CBS, as long as Showtime gets rewarded for making Dexter, I'm happy.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Jon V — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 07:27:49 -0000

Also just noticed... despite all of the big numbers total-viewer wise, the 18/49s were abyssmal. Were all the young kids watching the NBA all-Star game at bars and then partying?

The difference between total and 18/49 was the biggest spread I can remember.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 01:07:51 -0000

Ana, the problem is that with Dexter on Showtime the best it could do is a bit over million per new episode so 8 million is gravy. I compared the numbers of a cable show that first ran almost 2 years ago to a show that was trying to stay on the air deliberately.

Jericho performed better than Dexter, but relative performance was pretty close (and they both got their butts kicked by Knight Rider either way!), though I'd grant there was a smaller total audience watching the broadcast nets when Jericho ran.

if Dexter goes back to only being on Showtime (as will surely be the case for the "first run" of Season 3 of Dexter), who cares? But Jericho is on a trajectory to go off the air. I care!

Maybe CBS should think about putting Jericho on Showtime. I wonder how many new subscribers Showtime would have to get to keep it alive? 500,000?

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Steve — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:35:18 -0000

Ya, and Jericho brand spanking new while Dexter a 2 year old show censored all to heck. I'd really be interested in what kind of numbers Dexter pulls in on Showtime. I wonder how many folks have canceled HBO after the end of shows like Deadwood, Sopranos, and 6 Feet Under and migrated over to Showtime. I think the numbers for Dexter were very impressive considering the reasons stated in this article. Jericho on the other hand, I fully don't expect it to survive this shortened season 2 and plan to see the the final episode really being the grand finale. At least they will give it a proper ending this time. I don't intend on seeing a climb in ratings next week, as the trend in these serial shows is either you got on board or you didn't. (I don't know that for a fact, it's just logical reasoning that just now popped into my head.)Now it will be just the dropoffs from those that didn't like the first episode.

If I'm wrong, I'll buy you a donut. But only 1, and only 1 person. I'm not rich!

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Jon V — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:21:54 -0000

You go Ana. Love a girl who can crunch numbers.

It's a mele out there for programmers. Anything goes until next season. They're just throwin half-cooked spaghetti against the fridge right now.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Ana — Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:15:40 -0000

Someone posted this on the CBS Message boards:

"I think someone better look at the numbers again. The crux of this piece is that CBS can't get the 18-49 numbers. They then go on to compare Dexter to Jericho trashing Jericho being out performed by Dexter. But WAIT A MINUTE! Can we rewind the tape?

Total VIewers: Dexter 8.1 million out of 30 miilion viewers (27% of viewers), Jericho 7.3 million out of 22.78 million viewers (31% of viewers).

18-49 Demographic: Dexter 2.3/ 6 share; Jericho 2.5/ 7 share.

Dexter 3rd in time slot out of 3 shows in total viewers (.5 million out of 2nd, 4.78 million out of 1st) and in 18-49 share; Jericho 3rd in time slot out of 3 shows in total viewers (.8 million out of 2nd, 1.19 million out of 1st) and tied for 1st in 18-49 share.

Somebody get a clue!"

Weren't these your numbers from this week?
I'm a little confussed,
Ana

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 23:17:58 -0000

Jon V: I'm as surprised as you about The Simpsons, Family Guy, and Knight Rider. I had no idea Knight Rider was even going to be on and had I, I'm not sure I would have watched it. I will dig up the movie and give it a look though.

I'm not sure it's strike related or a fluke. Nostalgia, good theme song, talking cars. It seemed to gain strength every half hour and had very good 18-49 demo performance.

P.S. I think bell-bottoms were a late 60s and early 70s phenomenon. I was straight leg all the way in the 80s.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Jon V — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 23:08:32 -0000

Yah... what was up with Knightrider kickin butt? Are we about to trend back to the 80's... I think I've still got some bell-bottoms in storage. Is this a strike-related interim issue or just a fluke. (By the way, bought a new 'Stang last year cuz I just gotta have it).

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Jon V — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 22:05:56 -0000

I shoulda mentioned that the only FOX I use are the Sunday animations because I hate reality. Figgered they had been hyping the NEW episodes all week on all of their big ratings-winning shows and i would benefit without selling out. Now FOX finally gets 'creamed' and I'm all over it like s**t on stink.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Jon V — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 21:38:57 -0000

What a chump i am. Took the new FOX animations on my TV BigShot entries to have a nice night with all of their fans... and got creamed.

What happened?

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Rob — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 20:32:28 -0000

How is this for an absolute nightmare scenario? Can't you just imagine Ben Silverman looking at those inexplicably great Knight Rider numbers and penciling it in for fall Friday nights at 9 pm (the same time slot it had in the 1980s I believe), and tossing our beloved Friday Night Lights in the cancellation pile? Makes me sick to my stomach. This....the 1980s network of St. Elsewhere, Hill St. Blues, Cheers, Golden Girls, Cosby Show, Family Ties.......and what show do they try and remake??? The David Hasselhoff series.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Daniel C — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:35:28 -0000

Oh, absolutely Robert. I agree that FOX will win this year, overall. However, let's see how May sweeps go when all nets are at full strength.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:28:06 -0000

Daniel, I'll wager many beers FOX wins the year (with the "year" ending with the May sweeps). , reruns of CSI, etc., performed much better for CBS than reruns on other networks and that will be their "we withstood the strike!" mantra I suppose. completely agree with you about CBS inability at being nimble vs. the other nets, though I wouldn't say ABC was all that effective either.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Daniel C — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:26:26 -0000

I go back to the strike and that it hurt CBS the most. They are big and set in their ways and were not nimble in new programming. When the shows get going again, CBS will be back on top.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:26:22 -0000

now we're getting very Yogi-esque. Nobody ever goes there anymore, it's too crowded.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

deadendangel — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 19:11:43 -0000

Well, if American Idol was never shown again, I'd be happy.

This franchise is the worst thing that could ever happen to TV. It's the biggest load of crap there is.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:59:41 -0000

Daniel C. there is a lot of legacy thinking among people who have been following this stuff for ages. I don't think most of the legacy thinking is serving the television industry or the networks well at all.

We know what's going on RIGHT NOW. FOX is winning, and with American Idol, that lead is only going to widen. Despite my "attacks" on CBS, I'd agree it is a better run network than ABC or NBC (much better even). But, for me it's not just about doing better than your peers, it's also about making as much money as possible.

From my read, CBS is not focused on maximimizing viewers (or dollars). If that's because they are already making a ton of money anyway and they don't care, that's heinous.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Daniel C — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:39:57 -0000

Here's part of Robert Bianco's USAToday chat session today about the networks. I'd share he has a bit of a differing opinion:

"Waynesville, MO: What is up with NBC? It is amazing how much they have fallen from the glory days of Cosby Show/Cheers/Friends/early-ER. They seem to put junk on the air. I saw that there was American Gladiators and Knight Rider on last night. It this the 90's still. (There are some exceptions - 30 Rock, FNL, Scrubs, Office) Even the CW tries harder than this. Which network's higher-ups would you say are doing a good job?

Robert Bianco: Really, Waynesville - I have to thank you. If you hadn't mentioned "Knight Rider," which NBC aired without making available for review, I was going to have to find some way to work it in. I don't know when I've seen a more amateurish, inept heap of cynical junk on a major network. I'd call it a two-hour commercial, but that's an insult to commercials - most of which are better acted and constructed than this clunker. As for those two, poor actors stuck in the car for most of the movie: You can buy lox and bagels with more chemistry and more expressions. As for the question: CBS is widely regarded as the best-run network, with ABC and Fox vying for second. ABC is better at drama than comedy, and some of the decision-making, or makers, lean toward the erratic. Fox benefits and suffers from its beyond-control reality division. As for NBC - it's not just the worst managed network at the moment. It may have the worst management I've ever seen in all my years on the job."

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Dan D — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 17:24:32 -0000

The first season of Dexter is even available online at Netflix. You can watch an unlimited number of shows and movies that they have online if you subscribe to at least a one DVD a month plan, for under 9 bucks.
Dexter is all over the 'net. This is great exposure for the show.
I not feeling the mythology of the new Jericho season two.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Andy — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:03:35 -0000

Unfortunately, not a Nielsen family...it drives me crazy when I see my favorite shows doing poorly and I can't do anything about it! haha... I guess that's how everyone feels.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:02:15 -0000

it may matter to someone (not sure which DVR, who your provider is, etc. and whether they are selling your data), but unless you're a Nielsen family, it does not matter to the Nielsen data.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Andy — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 16:00:49 -0000

Oh, I was curious if my DVR viewing would matter. But clearly it doesn't. Thanks for the explanation.

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:58:31 -0000

Andy, it's not every DVR or even close. What Nielsen did for the 2007-2008 is increase the panel representation from about ~9% (I think) to 21%. So it should be that 21% of the Nielsen "sample" have DVRs.

Unfortunately short of what you could buy from Tivo data wise, the Nielsen DVR data is still the best freely available stuff. Consider that Tivo now represent less than 20% of the overall DVR market with Comcast, Time Warner, Dish, DirectTV etc. having the other 80%. While they can certainly collect data from the set top boxes, that data isn't available (at least to us).

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Andy — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:54:25 -0000

Thanks for your info Robert. Another question if I can ask... about DVRs. When those ratings are included, is it just a sample (like normal TV ratings), or is every DVR included?

Re: Nielsen Ratings Sun Feb 17: CBS Losing Badly With Younger Audiences

Robert Seidman — Mon, 18 Feb 2008 15:49:54 -0000

Andy, I've made a few inquiries regarding residual payments on reruns, etc. The consensus is, regardless how cheap BB is to make, if they would get twice as many viewers sticking on an hour of reruns of 2.5 Men, CBS is losing a measurable amount of money by running BB (or any poor performer) instead. And let me clarify, it's not that CBS is not making money anyway -- it indeed is. Its just not optimizing to make as much money possible. That's a disservice to its shareholders.